Click to expand.I hate the way Arsenal/Saiga labels there SGL line! They are very confusing, but basically SGL21 is a 7.62 rifle. The -61, 62 etc are the 'differnt models' they offer in the 7.62x39 caliber, all are the same base stamped receiver AK100 series rifle with differnt 'features'. Take a look at the K-var website and you will see what im talking about. You order a SGL21-62 and you get a stamped 7.62x39 rifle with plum furniture, order a -61 and you get black, these come with the Warsaw Pact lenght but stock.
Order a -71 and you get a stamped 7.62x39 rifle with black furniture in NATO length. NATO length is a couple inches longer than the Warsaw pact butt stock, some people perfer the extra length as the standard Warsaw pact lenght is kinda short. The SGL21-94 is the black russian side folder series. And if they offered in differnt colors im sure all the sidefolders would start with a 9 and the second number would be coded to the color. Ie 91 would be black, 92 plum etc. The 5.45 rifles start with SGL31 and are coded the same as the SGL21 rifles, same with the California compliant guns.
Hope this makes sense to you. Oh they dont offer a 5.56 Saiga Legion series. Arsenal offers the SLR 106 series which is 5.56 caliber. The Arsenal line is alot easier to follow they are all SLR with a 3 digit number starting with 10 and the third number relating to the caliber, followed by one or two letters to denote which style of AK it is. So an SLR 105UR would be a Krinkov clone in 5.45x39 with 16' barrel vice the orignal 8' barrel.
(note I dont think they ever offered the SLR 105UR for civilian sales and it would have came with an 8' barrel and would be full auto). Thanks so much for your help. For awhile i was expecting 'search' or a link to some other forum(which i don't really have time for.one or two is enough). For some reason i thought the last two numbers were years. I wish arsenal's site would provide the same explanation.
On saturday i shot one with black furniture (warsaw stock) and it was like love at first sight. It grouped so nice at far-pistol distance. So if i want that exact model it would be a '61? Also he said he picked it up for like $450 new a couple of months ago but every arnsenal i'm looking at is no less than $729 anywhere.
He's bs'ing or what? Thanks so much for your help. For awhile i was expecting 'search' or a link to some other forum(which i don't really have time for.one or two is enough). For some reason i thought the last two numbers were years. I wish arsenal's site would provide the same explanation. On saturday i shot one with black furniture (warsaw stock) and it was like love at first sight. It grouped so nice at far-pistol distance.
So if i want that exact model it would be a '61? Also he said he picked it up for like $450 new a couple of months ago but every arnsenal i'm looking at is no less than $729 anywhere. He's bs'ing or what?
Click to expand.Glad I could help, those model numbers they have are pretty confusing. He could be trying to pass a converted sporter Saiga off as a Saiga Legion. The Saiga Legion will say 'Saiga Legion' on the left side of the receiver, but if its an actual Saiga Legion then $450 is one helluva a price and I would snatch it up quick. One thing you might look out for, when the Saiga Legion was orignally put on the market they where sold with a converted front end (barrel componets) and a sporter stock back end. One way to tell is its going to say Saiga Legion on the receiver but more than likely if it was converted it was done at home and you will notice this by the trigger guard and the 4 extra holes in the receiver where the orignal trigger pins where located, and an extra hole or two on the bottom of the receiver around the trigger guard.
State of ohio license lookup. Also when most people convert a Saiga they do not replace the orginal trigger guard and will bolt the front end of it up under the mag latch. (this will also help you determine if it was orignally a sporter rifle also) This might not be the case at all with that gun, but should help you out with determining if its an actual SGL or a converted Saiga Sporter. If you are buying from K-Var or other reputable online dealer if it says SGL21-61 it should be an actual K-var/Arsenal, Saiga Legion SGL21-61 and not some home rolled or converted by xyz company.
Look at a Romanian rifle's serial number. At the end of the serial number, there is a dash followed by four numbers. These four numbers indicate the date of manufacture. For example, a serial number 2958E44-1967 indicates that the SKS was manufactured in 1967. Add the first digit in a Chinese serial number to 1956 to determine the manufacturing date. For example, the serial number 419998 indicates a manufacturing date of 1960.
Look at the two numbers at the beginning of a German SKS serial number to determine its date of manufacture. For example, a weapon with a serial number 75 B1329 indicates that the SKS was manufactured in 1975. Look at the four-digit number underneath the stamped star on a Russian rifle. This number indicates the year of manufacture.
Following the year stands for the Russian word for year.
Ak47 Serial Number
Serial numbers (usually just the last 4 digits) on most AK variants ( please don't call your rifle an AK47 because it is actually closer to an AKM, but then again most people don't care so just ignore this ) can be found on the bolt, bolt carrier, some have the recoil locking device, some on the receiver cover, and some on the gas tube. You should find the last four digits on the bolt and carrier. The other listed parts usually are on all Romanians but every now and then you will find one slightly different.
WASR is just one of many names the Romanians used on their rifles. Currently there are many WASR variations, but all started life being imported only able to use ATF approved single stack mags.
They are then modified by the importer to use standard AK mags and further modified to the sporting purpose clause of the new second amendment. Oh, and WASR does translate to Wassenaar Agreement Semi-automatic Rifle.
In this video I demo the fact that most Wasr10/63s have more matching serial numbers then Arsenal AKs do. If you watch the nutnfancy video where he goes to the Arsenal factory. You will see Walker English show nutnfancy a couple of Wasr10/63s that HE went and got. And he shows how the serial number on the bolt doesnt match the boltcarrier. And then shows the bolt and boltcarrier from his Arsenal rifle. And the bolt SN matches the boltcarrier. I bet if he took the rest of those wasr10/63s apart he would have looked stupid.
The reason Walker would look stupid is because The Arsenal rifles only have 2 matching SN's. And they don't even match the reciever SN. All my WASR10/63s have way more matching parts. This WASR10/63 has at least 6 matching SN's. 3 times what the 'GREAT' Arsenal rifles have. Thank you for watcing. Please leave comments as long as they're cunstructive.
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I was laid off about 9 years ago and had to sell my MAADI to make ends meet until I got a new job. I hated selling it, but whateva. I never cleaned mine, I shot it a lot and thrashed it to see how much abuse it would take. It was loose, sloppy, rough and had all kinds of tool marks. This MAADI never malfunctioned and I would easily trust it to defend my family.
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When Obama loses the election, there may be riots and you might need a good Kalashnikov to defend your home against crazed emotional hoards of losers. Click to expand.These are imported rifles. Century is the importer.
Free Serial Number Lookup For Guns
You obviously have not heard of the Draco, mini-Draco, M92 PAP, M85. There also other notable Century marked rifles that were assembled in the US that meet or exceed even Arsenal quality standards such as their Yugo M70AB2 and Polish 1960 AK-47. As far as holding value, just go look in the secondary market. Ive seen WASRs sold for $600 - a WASR! Good luck finding a mini-draco for under $900 (they used to sell for $350 last year). Texas driver's license audit number location. I think once people get over the ignorance and actually understand the history and the materials that go into these rifles, it's does not seem like its such a bad deal.
People get hung up on the label too much. Having said that, a Century MISR is an ok rifle. Most people though look for certain features on an AK. For the Maadi, it's the prebans, as well as the type with the Pharaoh crown markings, Arabic markings, bayo lugs, etc, etc. The MISR is not marked as such so it's less valuable compared to an INTRAC import. They are however, built on the same MAADI plant, just have different importers.
Click to expand.Without looking at the gun how does anyone know it is an imported model as opposed to one of their butchered rifles put together from various parts? That is why each gun with CIA on it should be inspected carefully and test fired before purchase - they are a crap shoot, with frequent jamming problems. Some are OK and some are not, plus how does one know if a previous owner attempted to fix a problem child but didn't know what they were doing and screwed it up even more and sold it just to get rid of it? There are a lot of those out there. CIA imported some Egyptian AKM's and later on imported just the bare receiver from Maadi, which they assembled with a bunch of left over MAK-90 parts from rifles they had to de-mill. I wouldn't want mismatched chinese parts in a Egyptian receiver with out-of-spec US parts mixed in. So that is why one has to be careful with the CIA Maddi's.
If it is one of the original imports then there probably isn't a problem. There are all kinds of other problem reports with a multitude of their products. FAL's CETME's Various AK's, and others. They are famous for grinding the mag well, feed ramps etc.
Indiscriminately to get a rifle out the door, they are also known to frequently use cheap out of spec parts like Hesse (Vulcan) receivers, undersized gas pistons, canted sights, improperly cast triggers, flimsy stocks, and the list goes on. Read more here and here. Click to expand.Yes CIA imported guns and resold them, I don't have a problem with that aspect of their products because they don't modify those (much). A CIA FAL is about $600 to $800 while a better import will go for 1500 or so and even a decent home-built gun will bring 1000-1200. They assembled guns from various parts and that is where they are notorious butchers.
Sometimes it's hard to tell which is which without studying the specific model and history of internet user complaints, which I have seen far too often related to CIA products. The facts are what they are and if it has CIA on it, it raises red flags in minds of anyone who has been fooling around with these types of rifles over the last 20 years. They do tend to have lower prices than similar products from other importers because of it. IMO The only person who would pay a high price for a Century gun is someone who doesn't know much about them. Click to expand.I am familiar with the Intrak since I have one. In the case of the CIA Maadi,my understanding is that they initially imported complete rifles from Egypt. These are just as good as any other post-ban Maddi import (except the pre-ban Styre models).
Then they started importing just the receiver and building a version with a bunch of Chinese parts left over from MAK-90's they had to de-mill due to the Chinese import ban. There's nothing wrong with Norinco parts either but they are from different specs and may differ slightly in various ways.
That like putting a Ford wheel on a Chevy and pounding the bolt pattern or grinding the hub opening to fit. If you like em, great.
Buy em while you can but for everyone else my advice is buyer beware.